Comments on: Memoirs of a Geisha by Arthur Golden

By: Modhran

Modhran — Fri, 05 May 2006 04:41:38 +0000

There are songs about Falling in love, there are songs about relationships ending, there are songs about the pain of bad relationships and the hurt of being in love with someone who doesn’t love you.

My old friend Steve Schoenbohm used to say, “When you’re happy in love, you don’t sit around moaning about it… At least not in iambic pentameter.”

Stories about being happy and content aren’t interesting. There is no conflict, and without conflict there’s no story.

By: kaizerin

kaizerin — Thu, 20 Apr 2006 20:25:35 +0000

Over on the “Eat Cake” thread, there was discussion about it being easier to write about sadness than joy. I presume Sayuri and/or Arthur Golden would agree with that, since the book devotes a couple of hundred pages to Sayuri’s life from 1929 to 1945-ish–all pain and struggle–and then polishes off 40 years of a happy, fulfilling relationship in just a few pages.

Sayuri says she doesn’t think any of us can talk about pain until we’re no longer suffering it. Are we even less capable of talking about joy?

By: kaizerin

kaizerin — Wed, 19 Apr 2006 19:34:56 +0000

Oh, I forgot to say: youâ€™re very welcome to establish your secular monastery just down the way from our secular convent. In fact, weâ€™ll quite rely on you to get things organized for the menfolk, as weâ€™ll be busy getting the convent set up, the serenity garden planted, the library established, etc.

We would like to have some of you gents over to see to our Wi-Fi setup at some point.

See you at the mixers!

By: kaizerin

kaizerin — Wed, 19 Apr 2006 19:18:40 +0000

If you’re interested in Elgin’s linguistic theories, the Native Tongue books are the ones to delve into. It’s the series she created Laadan for–a language that requires the speaker to indicate the intent behind the words by the case he/she chooses. Briefly: it’s the future, women are second-class citizens who can’t work outside the home; then humans encounter alien races and begin trade relationships with them, and interpreters are in desperately short supply. It is discovered that thirteen bloodlines have a natural linguistic ability that allows them to learn the alien languages without going mad, so all people with the talent must be employed at it–male and female. So the Linguist women get a small measure of power, and secretly set about finding a way to use it to liberate female kind.

Really, you want to read them. You know you do. Hey, did I ever give you “Tea with the Black Dragon” to read? If not, I’ll send it along to you–but will have to ask for it back, as it’s out of print and I only currently own one copy. (I buy it whenever I spot it in used book stores, but I keep giving copies away.)

By: Corvus

Corvus — Wed, 19 Apr 2006 17:40:12 +0000

You know, I’ve been meaning to read some of Haden Elgin’s sci-fi ever since I heard her call English a ‘liar’s language’ at a panel on writing alien languages. She immediately asked us not to quote her on that and went on to explain the semantic tricks possible in English that are impossible in most other languages in the world. “The trash was taken out,” is a perfectly valid response to the question, “Did you take out the trash,” for example.

But more on topic, I’d make an excellent secular monk… as long as I had my internet access.

Oh, and thanks to the dragon’s at tea image, I’m now going to be reading this. Thanks!

By: kaizerin

kaizerin — Wed, 19 Apr 2006 17:21:25 +0000

That is a great parallel to draw, Countess! Historically, both the geisha districts and convents offered women an alternative to the marriage-children-housewifery path they would have otherwise been bound to. It’s interesting how much power women held in the geisha districts–not only as geisha, but as owners of okiyas and teahouses, as providers of skilled services (wig-making, etc.), and even as accountants (I love it when Mameha sends her accountant in to deal with Mother on Sayuri’s behalf. I pictured two old dragons sitting calmly at tea while battling to the death over every last cent–with utter politeness, of course.)

But back to the attractions of the convent–yet another thing we have in common. Not that I would want to give up the wonderful man in my life, and not that I could devote myself to religious orders. But if there were a sort of secular convent, an order of science and reason, where I could devote myself to a simple life of quiet contemplation of the mysteries of the universe…why, yes. How appealing! (Erm…as long as we get conjugal visits, of course. Perhaps we could put the boys in a similar monastery across the lake? )

In this vein, I’ll ask if you’ve read Suzette Haden Elgin’s “Native Tongue” series of novels? This discussion is reminding me of them, strongly.

By: CountessZ

CountessZ — Wed, 12 Apr 2006 18:54:22 +0000

Tee hee. I noticed you were feeling the punctuation pretty strongly today.

Good summary. Having had the privilege of traveling in Kyoto and seeing some actual Meiko (Geisha in training)at one of the temples we visited, envisioning the world Golden is talking about comes so easily.

I think for me, the appeal of the Geisha is very similar to that which makes me want to be a nun from time to time (despite all the patriarachy and oppression). I like the idea of belonging to a community of women with secret rituals and a strong sense of history. Even though the Geisha interact with men, it is a highly feminine world that they inhabit.

Also, as you so appropriately point out, you don’t have to be a Geisha to find yourself faced with a decision to pursue what you really want and risk losing it all, or to settle for something safe and acceptable, but ultimately not highly fulfilling. Combine some feminine mystique with a solid universal theme and voila, an inspiring and intriguing read.

I can’t wait until you see the movie so you can tell me how the two compare.

By: kaizerin

kaizerin — Wed, 12 Apr 2006 15:48:45 +0000

I’ve just re-read this and thought I’d answer the question that must be on the top of your mind: yes indeed, I did just get a great big bag of punctuation, and I thought I’d share it with you all. Commas, colons, semi-colons for everyone!